Re: Mindscrew Mafia 6.0

by Dark Vessel Fri Jun 09, 2023 10:09 pm

I think you're the most appetizing target for a non-town player, Electrix. After all, you can shield people AND lie detect; the only reason you aren't target #1 is because some are suspicious of you. That, and the fact it looked like I had convinced you to shield yourself yesterday xD

by Supreme Overlord Sat Jun 10, 2023 4:37 am

Hmm. Eggs might be busy, but he seems to have been online (according to the Memberlist). A mechanic blocking vote counts?

Mod: vote count please?

That would be a real pain due to the information we're looking for in a vote count; but this is what I think we've got at the moment.
Well, after:
Vote: Electrix - following Scarfalot's ??? vote (though I'd still love more details on that), and the info-lynch we've apparently got today (which should also allow for a real lynch after).

Vote Count
Darth Skywalkerbacca (1) - Darth Skywalkerbacca
Electrix (2) - Sir_Scarfalot, Supreme Overlord

Not Voting: Sid_The_Kid, Electrix, Dark Vessel

FoS Count
Sid_The_Kid (1) - Supreme Overlord
The King of Eggs (1) - Sid_The_Kid

Not FoSing: Electrix, Sir_Scarfalot, Dark Vessel, Darth Skywalkerbacca

And my guess would be 4 to lynch, though with extra votes it still could be 5.

by The King of Eggs Sat Jun 10, 2023 1:53 pm

Welcome to my Domain!

Armistice 3 Complete

Vote Count Reset

Vote Count 1 Day 3

WARNING, Data Breach Detetected, Unsupported Message:
Unsupported Message wrote:Hello, hello? I really hope somebody is actually hearing this, or we are probably just confusing you more... anyway, Osgood here again with UNIT, we managed to repeat our last trick, the lynch has been compromised again. Repeat, the lynch has been compromised again.

Votes:

Players not voting:
Supreme Overlord
Sid_The_Kid
Elextrix
Sir_Scarfalot
Dark Vessel
Darth Skywalkerbacca

FoS':

Players not FoSing:
Supreme Overlord
Sid_The_Kid
Elextrix
Sir_Scarfalot
Dark Vessel
Darth Skywalkerbacca

WARNING: ELECTRONIC INTERFERENCE DETECTED (.../meadow.scene - corrupted)

With [Error] Players Alive it is [Error] to lynch

Deadline: [Error]

by Supreme Overlord Sat Jun 10, 2023 3:31 pm

Heyy a vote count!

Vote: Darth Skywalkerbacca
FoS: Sid_The_Kid

by Supreme Overlord Sat Jun 10, 2023 3:32 pm

Oh; I was paying attention to the Vote Count Reset - but there's no UNIT message, so has the info-lynch not gone through?

by The King of Eggs Sat Jun 10, 2023 3:43 pm

Supreme Overlord wrote:Oh; I was paying attention to the Vote Count Reset - but there's no UNIT message, so has the info-lynch not gone through?

... Fucks sake

I looked at that post for like 3 minutes going "I'm really forgetting something here..."

Edited

by Dark Vessel Sat Jun 10, 2023 5:00 pm

Well then, from my viewpoint it's absolutely either Overlord or Darth.

If we vote for one of them now, it's 2 cycles to victory, and 1 innocent death (night kill)
If we vote for Elextrix now, it's 3 cycles to victory, and 50/50 1-3 innocent deaths (2x night kill, 1x day kill at worst)
The way I see it, we have 3 innocents; maybe 4 if Sid votes on our side.

Voting for Elextrix is... Risky in my view. It'll get Scarf on our side, but Scarf dies tomorrow anyway, and I don't think he'll get a vote on that day (?)

by Darth Skywalkerbacca Sat Jun 10, 2023 5:06 pm

Well there is no point in voting either of us now that we're not going to be lynched. That's majorly annoying.

Unvote
Vote: Sid the kid

by Darth Skywalkerbacca Sat Jun 10, 2023 5:12 pm

Wait, sorry, not the town only lynch this is just the covers everyone lynch isn't it? So there would be no point in trying to lynch Sid because we already know his role.

My bad, it is past my bed time.

Unvote
Vote: Dark Vessel

There is some chance that Overlord might be scum, we never got that confirmed but if nobody is going to die it might as well confirm either Dark Vessel or Electrix today I guess.

by Dark Vessel Sat Jun 10, 2023 7:44 pm

Better to vote Electrix than me, since it would effectively prove me by proxy. Plus, he was the one under suspicion at the start.
I just think doing that will be sketchy.

by Dark Vessel Sat Jun 10, 2023 7:45 pm

I'll jump on the bandwagon if it looks like Electrix or Overlord will be targeted.

by Darth Skywalkerbacca Sat Jun 10, 2023 10:52 pm

I'm willing to switch to whoever people think is best.

I still don't think that Overlord is a good target for an intro lynch though considering we have to get get of at least one if not ideally both of us by the end of the game anyways.

by Darth Skywalkerbacca Sat Jun 10, 2023 10:55 pm

Should have read that back before I posted it but I feel it makes just enough sense for you guys to understand my point. Sorry about that.

by Sir_Scarfalot Sun Jun 11, 2023 12:37 am

Sir Scarfalot, Member of Resplect

Vote: Electrix him being proven would solve so many outstanding issues.

by Dark Vessel Sun Jun 11, 2023 12:42 am

Vote: Electrix
And can we all agree that if Electrix is innocent, we all vote Supreme tomorrow?

by Dark Vessel Sun Jun 11, 2023 3:01 am

Or is there some alternative plan of action?

by Supreme Overlord Sun Jun 11, 2023 3:51 am

I've been trying to think through the scenarios, and I think we've got some problems. I remembered this:

Electrix wrote:I have "Terrible Bedside Manner". It means that any ability that can reveal my alignment will reveal me as a member of the Mafia. The passive ability name is incredibly apt, considering my character and his personality.

Presumably this will cause UNIT to investigate as 'Mafia'.

If Dark Vessel is scum and investigation-immune, presumably UNIT will investigate as 'Town', same as the lie-detect.

Sid has flipped Neutral, Scarfalot has flipped Town; Darth and I have both claimed investigation-inverted. We basically already know what UNIT is going to say about everyone.

I think it still might be worth info-lynching Dark Vessel, for the case that they are scum that can trick lie detectors but not UNIT (so will come up as 'Mafia' or equivalent, counter to their claim). But other than that I don't see us getting much useful out of this.

We need to keep in mind Sid's claimed he ... actually, he never confirmed that he would leave Night 3 - that just makes sense to me if that's when he would win. So if Sid's still around Day 4, he could be lying about stuff like there are four factions; he might be the remaining killer.

Scarfalot presumably dies sometime Day 4 - if it's not at the start of Day 4 (and the game's still going), you're going to have to lynch quick if it's a 2-1 endgame (or, in the scenario where Sid's alive, 2-1-1; which I think is winnable if the three others lynch the killer, and then the Town lynches the other Day 5).

Dark Vessel wrote:Well then, from my viewpoint it's absolutely either Overlord or Darth.

I think we're just opposed at this point. From my viewpoint it's Dark Vessel and/or Electrix - and I think Dark Vessel is more likely.

Electrix's House abilities fit the flavour so well, have shown effects in thread, and work on a town role
Dark Vessel being investigation immune fits the available evidence and nerfs what otherwise looks like a pretty broken investigative role in Scarfalot
Lexa/Flame (some kind of AI) matches the kill flavour of 'deleted'

(I was going to add something on playstyle, but that's more subjective; plus every list needs three things.)

Darth, I don't think either of us are getting lynched (doing so intentionally screws Town too hard) - I think it'll come down to nightkills and the endgame scramble. Best-case scenario there is if we manage to lynch the killer Day 3 and Sid is still alive Day 4, outnumbered 4-1 (until Scarfalot dies; 3-1), can lynch one of us, can lynch Sid 2-1 Day 5.

by Dark Vessel Sun Jun 11, 2023 4:29 am

unvote

by Dark Vessel Sun Jun 11, 2023 4:32 am

As far as i'm aware, Overlord, Lexa isn't an AI - she can just upload her consciousness to a chip. She's a cyborg at max.

{???} has been inconsistent at best with Scarf, not even showing up every time he votes the same person. So far the only thing we can confirm is that Scarf can turn off lynches.

by Dark Vessel Sun Jun 11, 2023 4:35 am

You're awfully quick to say that we should see if i'm innocent via a lynch DIRECTLY after saying that Elextrix won't show anything via lynch due to a false positive, Overlord. Obviously if I give a false negative, it'd be the same. Though i'll admit, I find it strange that you would point that out.

by Dark Vessel Sun Jun 11, 2023 5:49 am

INB4 TKoE has been the one deleting us.

by Dark Vessel Sun Jun 11, 2023 5:50 am

To be fair, it WOULD be kinda fitting; this being a mindscrew, and the way ALL of his mod posts are so code-like...
But what would a lynch on TKoE even look like here?

by Sid_The_Kid Sun Jun 11, 2023 6:48 am

Supreme Overlord wrote:We need to keep in mind Sid's claimed he ... actually, he never confirmed that he would leave Night 3 - that just makes sense to me if that's when he would win. So if Sid's still around Day 4, he could be lying about stuff like there are four factions; he might be the remaining killer.

I can confirm, after consulting the egg, that a neutral that wins ceases to exist. The only way I’m a killer is if I’ve been a silent or unlucky(targeting the protected ones each night) SK.

Dark Vessel wrote:INB4 TKoE has been the one deleting us.

@Dark I sort of had that same thought as well

Sid_The_Kid wrote:
“Nested Quote”:

Ok … so Purple that’s “faction” 4 “Other” , so not: Mafia, Town, Neutral tagged wincon, definitely not a result I expected, especially the meadow wide light. Although that could mean FOS:TKOE.

as the count reset I’ll reapply FOS:TKOE, although it’s entirely possible that someone has a request/control ability where a task is submitted to the egg where by chance (request) or necessity (control) the egg completes the action. Which would possibly confuse my ability as it reveals the “most direct cause” of my death.

Supreme Overlord wrote:I've been trying to think through the scenarios, and I think we've got some problems. I remembered this:
Electrix wrote:I have "Terrible Bedside Manner". It means that any ability that can reveal my alignment will reveal me as a member of the Mafia. The passive ability name is incredibly apt, considering my character and his personality.
Presumably this will cause UNIT to investigate as 'Mafia'.

If Dark Vessel is scum and investigation-immune, presumably UNIT will investigate as 'Town', same as the lie-detect.

Sid has flipped Neutral, Scarfalot has flipped Town; Darth and I have both claimed investigation-inverted. We basically already know what UNIT is going to say about everyone.

The only faction information we all have for certain is that I flipped neutral, Scarf flipped Town. But Scarf then died and was resurrected, does this still mean he’s town? Although maintaining his UNIT ability does support that he is at least the same character with the same authority, although it could disguise an inversion within.
Is there anything that leads you to believe that the UNIT infected lynch doesn’t flip the player but investigates? And is thus affected by investigation inverting abilities?

Supreme Overlord wrote: I think it still might be worth info-lynching Dark Vessel, for the case that they are scum that can trick lie detectors but not UNIT (so will come up as 'Mafia' or equivalent, counter to their claim). But other than that I don't see us getting much useful out of this.

I’m not sure how I feel about confirming a lie detector target vs the lie detector themselves.
I’ll have to think a bit more on that one, but even an info lynch on SO would be better than no lynch.

by Darth Skywalkerbacca Sun Jun 11, 2023 12:22 pm

Unvote
Vote: Electrix

I have always maintained that I don't put a lot of faith into the legitimacy of the investigations in this game but if Electrix is going to be safe anyways more info is still more info. I don't see a problem with it.

by Supreme Overlord Sun Jun 11, 2023 12:55 pm

Sid_The_Kid wrote:Is there anything that leads you to believe that the UNIT infected lynch doesn’t flip the player but investigates? And is thus affected by investigation inverting abilities?

Mainly that the result of the UNIT lynch looked like an investigation result, with the pertinent line being:

The King of Eggs wrote:
Code:
dataBreach("Sir_Scarfalot") # Win Condition Tag = Town

The way I see it:

Lynch Electrix, result Mafia
What do we do with this information? It's exactly what we'd expect to see whether Electrix is Town or Mafia.

Lynch Electrix, result Town
I don't expect this to actually happen, given Electrix's claim (which, if Town, I'd expect to be true); and in any case still doesn't give us anything to work with on Dark Vessel.

(Though perhaps this is worth asking - does anyone as of right now actually think Electrix is scum? Like for me, they're not as confirmed as Scarfalot or Darth, but I'm thinking I'd only really be willing to lynch them after Sid and Dark Vessel are both dead/gone and the game's not over yet.)

Lynch Dark Vessel, result Town
This is what I'd expect to see whether Dark Vessel is Town, or investigation-immune - ie, it's already the info we have from Electrix's claimed lie-detect.

Lynch Dark Vessel, result Mafia
If this happens (which I do think is unlikely), we've actually got something we can use.

That all said, given how I don't think the 1/4 actually useful outcome is all that likely, perhaps it's better to just burn the info-lynch on Electrix and then at least have the rest of the Day 3 deadline to lynch for real.

Dark Vessel wrote:But what would a lynch on TKoE even look like here?

Actually actually, if we can't get Dark Vessel info-lynched, rather than burning it on Electrix, I think I'd rather Eggs. Either we get a 'no win condition'/'invalid target' without wasting much in the way of resources, or we do get whatever valuable information alternatively.

My preference for the info lynch:
Dark Vessel
Eggs
Electrix
These I don't really care about, but for the sake of putting in an order:
Supreme Overlord
Darth
Sid
Scarfalot

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